Link didn’t open for me. But the idea of having a two tier criminal system is just not the right thing to fight for right now. We’re not there as a society. It’s only going to lend itself to having voters see liberals and the left as a fucking joke
Indigenous people are over represented in prisons. The system is inherently racist.
The link works fine and you didn’t even read the article and are already making up strawmans.
Someone wants to pretend that generations of genocide didn’t happen. Out of touch white people stealing everything from indigenous folks and then having the audacity to demand for “equality” after rigging everything in their favour. Smug Europeans are nothing special.
They’re still committing crimes. Justice is for everyone including victims of crime. If a native American beats their wife or kids they should not have reduced sentencing because historically they were oppressed. That is wrong. Justice is not the place to create these considerations
For all intents and purposes, the numbers lay out that the Justice system, despite its lofty aspirations, is also clearly a racist one. One can accept both these points. But, I think the main point remains clear: programming and funding for social safety nets must be explored and protected.
Also, I think the suggestion that this translates simply to “reduced sentencing” is disingenuous. Courts still have to consider the background circumstances of accused persons before striking a balance between rehabilitation and deterrence. Anyone would agree that a blanket policy to reduce a sentence by virtue of one’s heritage or upbringing is wrong.
But you’re still raising your own problems with court sentencing as opposed to addressing the point raised which is the social safety nets are getting cut. These programs were already underfunded to begin with, and they were intended to help these over-represented populations get the leg up they actually need to even match up with “average” folks.
Most people in developed countries would be shocked to know that Canada continues to underfund and under support First Nations peoples. Some reserves don’t even have running water in 2025, and are forced to truck water for cisterns or melt snow when available. For decades in the past, people who lived on reserve could not leave freely, subjected to check stops like they were in some WWII ghetto. They can’t get services out to remote areas where they live due to chronically underfunded roads, the conditions are poor, and they’re constantly held back or down because of this. You want to treat First Nations and Indigenous Peoples as equals under the law? You can start by understanding how the government and society abused these communities from the start, then tucked away to be forgotten, only to be punished when they show up in public areas because they’re different.
Justice did not create these considerations. These are considerations Canadian society created through history, a karmic load. You just don’t want to pay it publicly.
OP’s point remains valid as First Nations and Metis peoples are over-represented in prisons. Even if the Justice system aspires to ideals of fairness and impartiality, it’s a human driven system. Despite courts even trying under the barest minimums to recognize these societal challenges, they REMAIN overrepresented in prison. Even the Justice System itself acknowledges this as a challenge even as its own existing staff and members continue operations.
TL;DR Courts try to recognize government and society’s role in harming First Nations and Metis Peoples over DECADES, and STILL end up incarcerating these people MORE than ANYONE ELSE.
Also, I suggest for any system that aspires for impartiality and fairness to be visibly biased is human. I believe that there needs to be some margin here - probably generous at this rate - to permit lessons to be learned by the Justice System, and by society. But, I believe such errors by the system end up being a force multiplier for frustration against reconciliation.
Yea sure. Nothing wrong with that. Government also provides social assistance, mental health support and outreach programs. The city I live in has a downtown that is destroyed by the homeless. The people trying to run their business have lost their livelihoods because the homeless hang out in the streets smoking crack and begging people for money. Nobody wants to bring their family downtown because of the drug use and drug users stumbling around at 3pm. Being a leftist and wanting to help the homeless shouldn’t mean we ignore the other people in society or the impact that homelessness has on everyone. I’m tired of having to accept drug use next to high schools just because people treat the homeless like lost kittens on the left. They’re real people. They make their choices. They deserve help but that doesn’t also mean we treat them like they don’t have autonomy or abilities of their own to not use drugs in areas where kids or businesses are trying to operate.
The cool thing is there’s a really easy solution that’s a lot more effective than blaming the homeless. Tax the rich and give the homeless… You’re never going to believe this… Houses.
I don’t disagree. I can get behind helping them in so many ways. At the sametime I want to make sure everybody can enjoy our cities if that makes sense.
Link didn’t open for me. But the idea of having a two tier criminal system is just not the right thing to fight for right now. We’re not there as a society. It’s only going to lend itself to having voters see liberals and the left as a fucking joke
deleted by creator
Indigenous people are over represented in prisons. The system is inherently racist.
The link works fine and you didn’t even read the article and are already making up strawmans.
Someone wants to pretend that generations of genocide didn’t happen. Out of touch white people stealing everything from indigenous folks and then having the audacity to demand for “equality” after rigging everything in their favour. Smug Europeans are nothing special.
They’re still committing crimes. Justice is for everyone including victims of crime. If a native American beats their wife or kids they should not have reduced sentencing because historically they were oppressed. That is wrong. Justice is not the place to create these considerations
For all intents and purposes, the numbers lay out that the Justice system, despite its lofty aspirations, is also clearly a racist one. One can accept both these points. But, I think the main point remains clear: programming and funding for social safety nets must be explored and protected.
Also, I think the suggestion that this translates simply to “reduced sentencing” is disingenuous. Courts still have to consider the background circumstances of accused persons before striking a balance between rehabilitation and deterrence. Anyone would agree that a blanket policy to reduce a sentence by virtue of one’s heritage or upbringing is wrong.
But you’re still raising your own problems with court sentencing as opposed to addressing the point raised which is the social safety nets are getting cut. These programs were already underfunded to begin with, and they were intended to help these over-represented populations get the leg up they actually need to even match up with “average” folks.
Most people in developed countries would be shocked to know that Canada continues to underfund and under support First Nations peoples. Some reserves don’t even have running water in 2025, and are forced to truck water for cisterns or melt snow when available. For decades in the past, people who lived on reserve could not leave freely, subjected to check stops like they were in some WWII ghetto. They can’t get services out to remote areas where they live due to chronically underfunded roads, the conditions are poor, and they’re constantly held back or down because of this. You want to treat First Nations and Indigenous Peoples as equals under the law? You can start by understanding how the government and society abused these communities from the start, then tucked away to be forgotten, only to be punished when they show up in public areas because they’re different.
Justice did not create these considerations. These are considerations Canadian society created through history, a karmic load. You just don’t want to pay it publicly.
OP’s point remains valid as First Nations and Metis peoples are over-represented in prisons. Even if the Justice system aspires to ideals of fairness and impartiality, it’s a human driven system. Despite courts even trying under the barest minimums to recognize these societal challenges, they REMAIN overrepresented in prison. Even the Justice System itself acknowledges this as a challenge even as its own existing staff and members continue operations.
TL;DR Courts try to recognize government and society’s role in harming First Nations and Metis Peoples over DECADES, and STILL end up incarcerating these people MORE than ANYONE ELSE.
Also, I suggest for any system that aspires for impartiality and fairness to be visibly biased is human. I believe that there needs to be some margin here - probably generous at this rate - to permit lessons to be learned by the Justice System, and by society. But, I believe such errors by the system end up being a force multiplier for frustration against reconciliation.
The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal loaves of bread.
Yea sure. Nothing wrong with that. Government also provides social assistance, mental health support and outreach programs. The city I live in has a downtown that is destroyed by the homeless. The people trying to run their business have lost their livelihoods because the homeless hang out in the streets smoking crack and begging people for money. Nobody wants to bring their family downtown because of the drug use and drug users stumbling around at 3pm. Being a leftist and wanting to help the homeless shouldn’t mean we ignore the other people in society or the impact that homelessness has on everyone. I’m tired of having to accept drug use next to high schools just because people treat the homeless like lost kittens on the left. They’re real people. They make their choices. They deserve help but that doesn’t also mean we treat them like they don’t have autonomy or abilities of their own to not use drugs in areas where kids or businesses are trying to operate.
The cool thing is there’s a really easy solution that’s a lot more effective than blaming the homeless. Tax the rich and give the homeless… You’re never going to believe this… Houses.
I don’t disagree. I can get behind helping them in so many ways. At the sametime I want to make sure everybody can enjoy our cities if that makes sense.
Agreed.