President Trump strongly criticized Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky after a tense argument in the Oval Office on Friday. Trump accused Zelensky of showing disrespect toward the United States…
That’s the sad fact of the matter. Trump and Vance and Elon and the rest of the administration are a fucking catastrophe, yes. But what is even worse than that, what is even more damaging for the long term viability of diplomacy, of international relations and governance, is that even when these clowns are gone, it can happen again.
Every time another country signs a trade deal, an alliance, a pact, an agreement of any sort with the US, even if the current leadership is absolutely incredible, that can change dramatically on a dime within 4 years. That has always been true, of course, but historically the precedent has been that new administrations are largely consistent in upholding international agreements. But a new precedent has been set, that agreements (aka “sheets” as the dumbass calls them) are worthless, that they can be torn up on a whim, that peace may require you to fluff the ego of a megalomaniac and kiss his feet, that you might have to placate idiocy and bravado and STILL have your economy rocked by asinine trade policies, that the threat of invasion and war could be a negotiation tactic for trade deals…
Countries are going to completely detach themselves from the US in all matters, and they absolutely should. We are going be turned into a North Korea-like state. Cut off from world trade and information, no diplomacy, just a looming threat to the whole world. Fuck me, this shit is bleak.
It won’t go so far as being like North Korea. But there are countries out there that don’t get good trade deals because of this exact problem. We will have to pay more for every trade deal we make for the next 30 years because other countries can’t be sure we’ll keep our end of it. It’s just like getting a loan with a bad credit rating. You can still get the loan but the bank is going to demand more compensation because of the risk.
I think that so many things are going to get fucked up between now and then that we would need a constitutional convention just reweave the threads of our society.
Congress can’t legislate its way out of this mess anymore.
They could. They absolutely could. They could pass laws regulating the Supreme Court and pass laws specifically reserving powers to itself, including more congressional agencies. Like a congressional department of justice, a congressional law enforcement arm, and a law removing the president from control of military appointments and nominations. (Effectively giving him a force made by Congress, that he can command but cannot easily subvert)
But isn’t part of why we are here is because our Constitution is vague to some people, it’s clauses without claws… What happens when the supreme court interprets the laws to be unconstitutional, whats to stop us from just doing this all again… People are not properly represented the electoral college, among many other things need to be fixed.
If SCOTUS goes completely rogue and just declares Congress to be unconstitutional then all bets are off. And yeah that’s scary. But within the rules there are still things that could be done.
It can happen again? This is “it” happening again. We suffered you guys having a first trump administration, we thought you learned, but you elected him even harder the second time.
Every time another country signs a trade deal, an alliance, a pact, an agreement of any sort with the US, even if the current leadership is absolutely incredible, that can change dramatically on a dime within 4 years.
this is what putin wanted all along, isolate the us, so they dont intefere with RUSSIAS internal matters, such as with crimea, ukraine, russian satellite states.
You’re being too pessimistic. Alliances have always been about being strange bedfellows that’ll stab each other in the back should the proper conditions ever be met.
No matter how kissy-kissy politicians may be in front of a camera, backroom dealing is still the norm. Only the orange guy mistook the backroom with a toilet and so it stinks of shit for everyone to see.
Whatever the end result of this, whoever’s left afterwards will get back to tender intimacies without a hitch.
Yup. Politics are ugly. Always have been, hopefully won’t always be as well.
We generally don’t see the ugliness, but right now it’s fully exposed.
The recoil from seeing it happen might be hard to swallow, but that doesn’t make it any worse than it usually is when hidden.
But we can also see the strength of having to go through that and still walk away.
Now I’m hoping the next period of time won’t prove me wrong and this moment will be an important impetus for change towards the better.
If I am proven wrong though, I’ll join your pessimism.
This isn’t just bad politics. We’ve publicly threatened invasion and annexation of our closest allies.
Trump irreparably compromised our national security by doing this. We rely heavily on our alliances and soft power for counterterrorism, military and counterintelligence operations. Before Trump, we were leading the most powerful network of defense alliances in the world. In one month Trump pissed that away, and made us a much weaker country.
You’re seeing the US through a colored lens. It started losing its stride a couple of presidencies before Trump. Had the opportunity to make a comeback in several ways, yet shat on each and every one.
Trump’s just the biggest visible zit on the US. Every other zit pushing him into prominence were something no one tried to clean before they got infected with pus.
It’s all ugly and something that’s been brewing for a long time.
This ain’t no one man show. The “treason” is just an inner conflict that was left untreated for a long, long time. The US needs to start healing itself, pronto.
Trump is only the symptom. I’ve seen the Republicans walk into this direction more and more every cycle. Bush, Dubya, ahh then I remember Palin who didn’t win with her Tea Party chums etc. - it culminated in Maga.
And even if Trump turns dead by suffocation, having his head up Putin’ s ass tomorrow - he’s only the most visible figure of this theater, and there a few more who probably wait to be King when the King is dead.
Nevertheless, what the post before said is important - the US was a soft power, being in the center of a huge balanced. network of allies. That network, the one the Magas shat on, is what guaranteed stability for all. (And yes, I’m aware politics always was a dirty business - but not in this way)
There were probably a lot of shouting matches between politicians in the past, probably even between presidents. But fucking never on live TV, now none of they can’t move without losing face. What a sharade.
That’s the sad fact of the matter. Trump and Vance and Elon and the rest of the administration are a fucking catastrophe, yes. But what is even worse than that, what is even more damaging for the long term viability of diplomacy, of international relations and governance, is that even when these clowns are gone, it can happen again.
Every time another country signs a trade deal, an alliance, a pact, an agreement of any sort with the US, even if the current leadership is absolutely incredible, that can change dramatically on a dime within 4 years. That has always been true, of course, but historically the precedent has been that new administrations are largely consistent in upholding international agreements. But a new precedent has been set, that agreements (aka “sheets” as the dumbass calls them) are worthless, that they can be torn up on a whim, that peace may require you to fluff the ego of a megalomaniac and kiss his feet, that you might have to placate idiocy and bravado and STILL have your economy rocked by asinine trade policies, that the threat of invasion and war could be a negotiation tactic for trade deals…
Countries are going to completely detach themselves from the US in all matters, and they absolutely should. We are going be turned into a North Korea-like state. Cut off from world trade and information, no diplomacy, just a looming threat to the whole world. Fuck me, this shit is bleak.
It won’t go so far as being like North Korea. But there are countries out there that don’t get good trade deals because of this exact problem. We will have to pay more for every trade deal we make for the next 30 years because other countries can’t be sure we’ll keep our end of it. It’s just like getting a loan with a bad credit rating. You can still get the loan but the bank is going to demand more compensation because of the risk.
I think that so many things are going to get fucked up between now and then that we would need a constitutional convention just reweave the threads of our society.
Congress can’t legislate its way out of this mess anymore.
They could. They absolutely could. They could pass laws regulating the Supreme Court and pass laws specifically reserving powers to itself, including more congressional agencies. Like a congressional department of justice, a congressional law enforcement arm, and a law removing the president from control of military appointments and nominations. (Effectively giving him a force made by Congress, that he can command but cannot easily subvert)
But isn’t part of why we are here is because our Constitution is vague to some people, it’s clauses without claws… What happens when the supreme court interprets the laws to be unconstitutional, whats to stop us from just doing this all again… People are not properly represented the electoral college, among many other things need to be fixed.
If SCOTUS goes completely rogue and just declares Congress to be unconstitutional then all bets are off. And yeah that’s scary. But within the rules there are still things that could be done.
T-minus and counting…
It can happen again? This is “it” happening again. We suffered you guys having a first trump administration, we thought you learned, but you elected him even harder the second time.
A very fair point.
The “Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde” effect.
this is what putin wanted all along, isolate the us, so they dont intefere with RUSSIAS internal matters, such as with crimea, ukraine, russian satellite states.
You’re being too pessimistic. Alliances have always been about being strange bedfellows that’ll stab each other in the back should the proper conditions ever be met.
No matter how kissy-kissy politicians may be in front of a camera, backroom dealing is still the norm. Only the orange guy mistook the backroom with a toilet and so it stinks of shit for everyone to see.
Whatever the end result of this, whoever’s left afterwards will get back to tender intimacies without a hitch.
Is this take supposed to be less pessimistic?
Yup. Politics are ugly. Always have been, hopefully won’t always be as well. We generally don’t see the ugliness, but right now it’s fully exposed. The recoil from seeing it happen might be hard to swallow, but that doesn’t make it any worse than it usually is when hidden. But we can also see the strength of having to go through that and still walk away.
Now I’m hoping the next period of time won’t prove me wrong and this moment will be an important impetus for change towards the better.
If I am proven wrong though, I’ll join your pessimism.
This isn’t just bad politics. We’ve publicly threatened invasion and annexation of our closest allies.
Trump irreparably compromised our national security by doing this. We rely heavily on our alliances and soft power for counterterrorism, military and counterintelligence operations. Before Trump, we were leading the most powerful network of defense alliances in the world. In one month Trump pissed that away, and made us a much weaker country.
What we’re seeing here is full on treason.
You’re seeing the US through a colored lens. It started losing its stride a couple of presidencies before Trump. Had the opportunity to make a comeback in several ways, yet shat on each and every one.
Trump’s just the biggest visible zit on the US. Every other zit pushing him into prominence were something no one tried to clean before they got infected with pus. It’s all ugly and something that’s been brewing for a long time.
This ain’t no one man show. The “treason” is just an inner conflict that was left untreated for a long, long time. The US needs to start healing itself, pronto.
Trump is only the symptom. I’ve seen the Republicans walk into this direction more and more every cycle. Bush, Dubya, ahh then I remember Palin who didn’t win with her Tea Party chums etc. - it culminated in Maga.
And even if Trump turns dead by suffocation, having his head up Putin’ s ass tomorrow - he’s only the most visible figure of this theater, and there a few more who probably wait to be King when the King is dead.
Nevertheless, what the post before said is important - the US was a soft power, being in the center of a huge balanced. network of allies. That network, the one the Magas shat on, is what guaranteed stability for all. (And yes, I’m aware politics always was a dirty business - but not in this way)
There were probably a lot of shouting matches between politicians in the past, probably even between presidents. But fucking never on live TV, now none of they can’t move without losing face. What a sharade.
What an absurd viewpoint