Like the title says, are there any EVs that just have a Bluetooth radio and that’s it? Like a normal car, not a smartphone on wheels? If not, do you all think that this will actually happen at some point? This is the main reason why I can’t (and will never) buy an EV. I like to have actual buttons everywhere on my car. I think those massive tablets on these cars with all the touch buttons are very dangerous. I like an “entertainment system” that only connects to my phone with either a headphone jack of or Bluetooth. It’s a car, not a PC.
Not that I know of. Let smaller automakers make EVs and we might get something like that.
But with the federal government mandating that all cars must have automatic braking after a certain date in the future I guess we’re never going to get away from tons of sensors and computers in cars.
I mean, the government has mandated that all cars built since the 90s have to have a lot of computers and sensors for engine monitoring and emissions logging so that ship has long since sailed. Automatic braking is also credited with eliminating something like 1 in 5 fatalities in car accidents, so as long as we have any motorized vehicles around at all I don’t really have a problem with the government requiring manufacturers to spend the extra 20 dollars or so per vehicle it costs them to add a few ultrasonic sensors and a microcontroller it takes to slow the vehicle to the point where a driving into a pedestrian might just be survivable.
Automatic braking doesn’t require the level of tech that’s being packed into EVs these days
You could make automatic breaking without a full blown computer, but it’s so much cheaper to put a full-blown computer than it is to do it all in hardware. Everything uses turing complete equipment now, it’s actually less expensive at this point.
There’s absolutely no reason not to put multiple computers in the car I think the real win is not surfacing it to the end user.
“Tech” is a conflated term. The way I read OP is that they don’t want their cars main user interface to be a smartphone app. Doesn’t mean the car can’t be technologically advanced.
Exactly. If my car can connect to the internet then it has too much tech in it.
The ability for a car to call emergency services in the event of a crash, and thus the mobile / data connection required to do that, has been mandatory since 2018 in all new cars sold in the EU.
So there is no cost incentive not to have the internet connection in there, as it is a basic safety feature now, like seatbelts.
You don’t need a data plan to call emergency services. Any protocol-compatible device can dial 911/112/etc. for free.
This is why in remote areas your phone may say “Emergency Calls Only”. Your carrier isn’t available, but someone else’s is and they are legally obligated to route emergency calls.
Of course if your car has a modem and a computer, adding a data plan isn’t a huge leap. But it’s a recurring expense and plenty of cars sold today do not have internet connectivity, at least on the cheaper side.
They also mandate a backup camera, so that means they need to have a screen.
I tried an VW ID3 this weekend, the software was low key, it mostly relied on you having Apple Car or it’s android equivalent.
You might want to look into taking an older car and paying to get someone to install a conversion kit. If you have an existing car you could see if there’s a compatible kit that’ll save you some money.
From what I’ve seen, conversions are generally preferred on pre OBD cars, as even the accessories like lights, AC etc run through that.
It puts you back looking at vehicles from the 70s or earlier. VW beetles, combis,Porsches seem to be popular choices.
Is there an issue with running OBD for the accessories, but not the engine?
OBD2 wasn’t mandatory until 1995 in the US, and OBD1 was really primitive. I suspect an EV conversion of an '80s or early-'90s car would be okay too.
I mean, I think EV needs to be separated from the fancy systems here. I see ICE vehicles with fancy touchscreens with no buttons, they aren’t an EV specific thing.
As for me, I have the Hyundai Kona EV, I love the thing. Yes, it has screens, I think they’re neat, but specifically it has physical buttons below the screens to control the entire car with physical buttons. That was a hard requirement of mine. So, if you want no screens or anything then no, unless you buy the cheapest car out there right now you’re probably getting something “smart”, and those happen to be ICE cars because at this point they’re cheaper. If your actual issue is physical buttons, then sounds like you need to go actually test drive some. The only EV I know of with no buttons is a Tesla, and there are a ton of other EVs out there.
specifically it has physical buttons below the screens to control the entire car with physical buttons. That was a hard requirement of mine.
I’d love to get av EV with physical buttons too. My current car is a 2012 Mazda 3, but I want to get a EV to take advantage of my solar panels.
The Kona looks nice. Do you know if it supports Qi wireless charging, and wireless Android Auto?
It does! Just used it today! There’s a wireless charger just under the main dash in front of the drink trays, and I can confirm Android Auto works perfectly wirelessly. When we got it the sales guy said it’d be coming in a later update, and we were like “uh yeah, sure”, but it honestly worked day one, no updates needed. Feel free to DM me, happy to answer any questions honestly.
Had a 1998 Citroen Electrique once. Not much fancy electronics there…
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I don’t think you can easily find new thermal cars without technology, so EVs
Old man yells at cloud.
Hopefully someday.
eBikes
While an amazing option for city commutes, mine is close to 100km daily. I have no idea if it’s possible to use an e-bike for that, but it would certainly take up even more of my limited free time to do so.
That’s pretty extreme commute, a deeply unsustainable one regardless of the type of power system in your car.
So, you want them to sell their house now? Lol
Yup, it is. Unfortunately, I had to endure that for close to a year (I will be assigned somewhere else this summer) and me and my colleagues had to carpool. Public transport would have been the best, but for that route the bus only goes twice a day.
Nevertheless, e-bikes are great if your commute isn’t that long!
The problem is that it takes a lot of computer power needed to run an EV. Battery management, power management, motor control, etc. Requiring that much computer power makes it a cheap and easy decision for car makers to just make everything part of that system.
We will get there eventually but it’s going to take a lot of people to want it (many people aren’t even considering an EV as a future car purchase), a lot of the under-the-hood stuff will have to be shoved away, and charging/battery management need to be simplified while still being robust and reliable. I don’t see it happening any time soon, ICE vehicles have only been getting more and more complex in this way. “Stick a tablet in there” is so cheap and easy and resolves so many manufacturing hurdles.
Bespoke windows controls? Nah, button on a screen. Custom entertainment system? App on a tablet. Backup camera screen? Just put in on the screen so it’s the only thing you can see while backing up.
If car makers cant get around these hurdles without incurring, previously saved, costs, the trend will continue.
The problem is that it takes a lot of computer power needed to run an EV. Battery management, power management, motor control, etc. Requiring that much computer power makes it a cheap and easy decision for car makers to just make everything part of that system.
How much does that take, exactly? It sounds like something a cheap microcontroller that you might find in a dumb appliance could easily do.
The thing about screens being easier than n custom physical buttons is true, though. I’m waiting for someone to put a haptic display in a car so the safety problems are somewhat ameliorated.
I am not an engineer, but I imagine keeping multiple DC motors running efficiently/in sync together while outside influences change by the second isn’t easy. Communication with a variety of EV chargers at different levels of power must take a logic system. ICE vehicles have a lot of physical parts with 120 years of engineering behind keeping things in order. There just isn’t that level of engineering for EVs, which have only really been developed during the era of microchips.
None of that takes much power, nor is it unique to EVs. ICE have much of that now.
Also cars are not centralizing those systems. They’re all in independent modules.
Maybe we are looking at different cars, I only really am exposed to American cars. Any vehicle I have been in made after 2021 have integrated most things into the infotainment system. Which are now also integrated into the operations of the cars.
And ICE vehicles rely, quite heavily, on the hundreds of moving parts that have been engineered for 120 years. Nothing mechanical can really regulate managing the charge rate of the battery, or are able to calculate the necessary changes in power to each motor, or managing any kind of safety system. As some of those things have been added to ICE vehicles, the lack of buttons has been notable.
I got a 2022 Hyundai Kona EV. It does have a touch screen, but most functions can be done with buttons, except for navigation. It does have Android auto, but you don’t have to use it. It has an aux port or Bluetooth audio as an option
Second that, we own the non-EV version and the central console is pretty well designed. The car itself has a few ergonomy flaws though imho
The entertainment system in most cars are separate from the actual car computer. You can just turn it off, or only use the radio. I think it’s only Tesla where it’s necessary to use the screen in order to operate the car.
EVs however is one place where it makes some sense to have some software connection to the car, if you want to time the charging to the electricity price or set a tine to preheat and such, that’d be difficult to make with physical buttons. I’d prefer just to have an simple app for it, because I really dislike the proprietary software in the cars.
You only need the screen to operate a Tesla on any model without stalks.
I’ve never tried to open the frunk with voice commands, but it probably works.
I want to talk to my car even less than I want to operate a touch screen.
If you have an old truck, Edison Motors has preorders for the Pickup Truck conversions. The kit will only have the drive train stuff in it and anything else is not something they’re interested in. They are working with autoshops to do the conversions, so it’s not a DIY thing.
Nice. I don’t have a truck, I was just wondering in case I want to replace my car in the future.
Well, another thing that’s nice about Edison Motors is that they’re the Engineers, Mechanics and End Users for the kits. It all started because they wanted a Tesla Semi Truck to try for their logging company, but got snubbed by Tesla. It should have much higher usability then a truck designed by someone who’s never driven a truck before.
This isn’t like a Prius where the Engine, Electric Motor and Tires are all connected mechanically at some point. The Diesel/Generator unit is only connected to the E-Axle via electrician power. Because the company supported open standards and open documentation, you could just get the e-axle, ESC, and battery pack and build a pure EV around it. They need to focus on a simple product line with the broadest use cases for starting though, so I’m not surprised they aren’t talking about pure EV trucks.
There’s also strong community and wealth of information on swapping EV guts into older cars. You get the benefits of EV without the spyware and info-distractions. These are all custom jobs though, so a cost estimate is impossible. Deboss has a very interesting EV project going on right now. Edison says the total cost of their kits should be around 1/3 to 1/2 the cost of a new truck
I have an old Scottsdale truck I’m eyeing for a Edison conversion. The juxtaposition of a modern diesel/EV hybrid drive train combined with an 80’s square body truck with manual crank windows it too irresistible. All running on biodiesel as well.
All new cars have infotainment systems and computerized controls and displays these days. This is in no way specific to EVs. In Europe there is the Dacia Spring. That’s a very simple and down to the absolute essentials kind of vehicle. But not something I would ever want to drive.
