By employed I mean get a job in the industry either offline or online. Ideally something that would highly likely remain in-demand in the near future.
Entry level networking technician. You can get a bunch of useful Cisco certifications for free on their website. Try to get yourself an old switch from ebay to practice setting up a small network, vlans etc., and you’ve got a solid start.
Try to get yourself an old switch from ebay to practice setting up a small network, vlans etc., and you’ve got a solid start.
This is what (older) millenials had to do when they wanted to play video games with their friends, no broadband internet, we moved the computer, set up a lan. Good old time. But this is how 20-25 years latter, I have basic knowledge of network, and look at puzzled Gen Z kids when I tell them to set their IP adress and ping the hardware
Your comment made me really nostalgic for the days of setting up pan parties, configuring hamachi servers, etc. Good old days
Sure as hell wouldn’t know what port forwarding is if it wasn’t for playing lan games online
My entire devops career started with writing stupid E2 programs in GMOD and hosting a private Minecraft server (IIRC it was Bukkit or something similar). This is the real pride and accomplishment.
Aw yeaaah Java bukkit waddap
I work in cybersecurity now, though I spent about 15 years in Systems Administration. I credit my career to my father buying a computer and letting me tinker with it. There were two factors that taught me a ton about computers:
- Creating boot disks for games (this was back in the heyday of MS-DOS).
- Realizing “oh shit, I had better fix this before dad gets home.”
Nothing teaches how to work on computers quite like working on a computer. And much of that “working” is actually figuring out how to un-fuck the computer you just fucked up.
I see this as also a very future proof career. Even if businesses move the vast majority of their infrastructure to the cloud they’ll still have an on premises network presence.
Appreciate the response! Any specific video/reading course to start with?
Honestly? Pretty much anything. Not a senior level position unless you’re willing to really fudge your resume but entry or mid level - sure. If you put your nose to the grindstone you can learn to do pretty much anything in a year… that’s a long fucking time.
What kind of IT were you looking at? System administration? IT Support/Help Desk? Development? Networking? Ops?
What do you think of cloud computing in general? Cloud dev, cloud admin, or cloud architect? Good idea to invest all my free time into?
Yea, I don’t think it’s going anywhere anytime soon.
Thanks for responding! Honestly, I’m looking for a profession that is most likely to remain in-demand for the foreseeable future. Secondly, well, the income potential, of course. What would you recommend?
I’m self-taught as well, and I’d say look through the current job market and offerings, but don’t worry all that much - teaching yourself IT usually nets you a considerable amount of transferable skills that you build upon if things don’t work out in one field; you also learn to learn and get much more comfortable with switching branches.
The less volatile your branch is, the less likely it is to turn out to be a fad that you’ll have to drop several years down the line at best. Crypto and blockchain, for example, were probably often recommended when the thing was on the rise, but that’s nowhere near as popular and safe now; I believe the current AI hype to follow the same fate. Basically, look at the news and trends and be careful with whatever big and stupid corporations push for, praise, or massively invest in: that’s usually nothing but good marketing successfully baiting the suits.
Web develoment is probably going to stay simultaneously volatile and relevant for decades more, so that’s a good option. Embedded development shouldn’t be going anywhere either, although that’s more low-level and intimidating, but it can be fun and stable and pay relatively well. I hate the smartphones industry and can’t really say much about Android or iOS development, but I doubt it’s doomed or anything.
So far, it seems like not following whatever Elon Musk or other billionaires tell you is the future is a good bet.
You really can’t go wrong landing an IT help desk position at a moderate sized non-tech company. You’ll be an essential employee and get a lot of recognition for your work.
Hmmmm…
Nothing wrong here.
I went in with a 4 year degree, the other grad next to me went in with a 6 month kinda masters. You can pull it off if you try hard enough and know your shit, wish I’d known that before I wasted so long at uni.
6 month kinda masters
What’s that, diploma mill?
I assumed they misunderstood how a 4 1/2 year master’s program works, since the masters part is technically only half a year on paper. But I don’t think that necessarily makes sense in context…
Sr level would easily get weeded out during the interview process.
You’d think so. You’d definitely think so.
I think mobile development is best for this. Very technical, but still a lot of products and companies and not quite so spammed with bootcamps.
So I went to university on a general computer science course, so this might already discount this answer. However, during my final year, a friend who was already in the industry convinced me to push towards a cloud engineering role (systems engineering specifically with cloud services like Amazon and Azure). This was not something my course covered at all, so we went through containers, AWS, Terraform, Kubernetes etc. during our free time before he got me an interview for a junior role when I graduated. I was very lucky with my circumstances but I don’t think I would’ve gotten the role without that extra study.
These roles are in demand and will be for the foreseeable future. If you have general Linux knowledge then you should be able to pick it up fairly quickly.
Thanks! Any specific course recommendations?
Pretty much anything if you’re willing to crush out some certs. 365 is in-demand and you can learn everything on Microsoft’s training modules. Alternatively, programming pays well if you’re willing to learn the languages.
Once you get your foot in the door, focus on upward mobility by job hopping. Always take a better job title over higher pay if you want the big bucks later on.
Also bear in mind that most IT jobs favor personality over skill set, even if they deny it on paper.
[off topic]
A while back I was off work for six months after injuring my hand at work. I’d never liked any of my jobs, but knew I had to earn a living.
Someone suggested this book. It lead me to taking a course and finding a career I really enjoyed. The career was something I’d never considered for myself, but it turned out to be a great fit for me.
“Discover What You Are Best At,” by Linda Gail. Should be available in most libraries.
This book has been published in 98. Is it honestly still relevant more than 20 years later, post www burst and GPT?
“How to Win Friends and Influence People” was published in 1936 and is still useful.
Because the human psyche didn’t change much. But the job world certainly did
According to the website it’s been revised for the digital age.
The term IT is extremely broad now, and it will depend on your interests, but it’s not all that difficult to get into.
There is quite a large demand now for certain skill sets that large companies where traditionally only hired people with specific degrees for IT roles are now opening those up to people without degrees at all.
Some general roles companies are in demand for now are web developers, data analysts, and cloud services.
Cloud services is also a broad category, but a lot of companies are looking for, and will be in demand in the near future, is a cloud storage engineer/ data engineer (however the company decides to spin it), where you essentially try to optimize the usage of storage the company is utilizing. You can easily learn the basics through AWS and really honing in on their s3 capability.
Anything related to data analyst/science is in high demand due to companies collecting so much data on their customers they have no clue what to do with it all. Data science teams basically figure that out for the company.
Easiest role to get your foot in the door would probably be IT technician/help desk, but in my opinion that’s also a harder one to break out of into other roles. It really depends on the company and how closely those help desk roles are aligned with other departments.
I studied hard for a few months, got my A+ and network+ certs from CompTIA.
Got my first helpdesk job making about 47K. 3 years later I was making 85K as a sysadmin. Stay in Helpdesk for 12-24 months, keep studying, start to learn a major infrastructure brand, Azure, AWS, Red Hat Linux, Xen Server, Cisco, etc.
Stay aggro on salary, don’t be afraid to jump from job to job as long as you’re there for at least a year and you leave on decent terms.
And for the love of Tux, don’t settle for piss pay. I can’t tell you how many IT folks I’ve met already in the industry who are Sys admins/engineers/network admins, making 20%,30%,40% under the average pay in their area. Money isn’t everything, but it sure as hell ain’t nothing either.
And never forget: The company doesn’t care about you.
Thanks. So is your advice to, basically, study networking?
Not only networking unless you just wanna be a network admin. But networking is one of the most important components, you need the basics to be a good sys admin regardless.
Understand IP addressing, subnets, DHCP, DNS, OSI model, basics of packet anatomy, basics of routing and switching.
Have a solid understanding of those things plus a few other networking subjects, you’ll be able to troubleshoot really well. Don’t be the sys admin who barely understands IP addressing, I’ve known that person…not good.
All great advice, but I’m curious why you say you should leave on decent terms? As long as you don’t get fired, what’s wrong with being candid in an exit interview and potentially ruffling feathers by saying what you couldn’t before?
Leave on such good terms that you can use them as references and don’t have to fear them bad mouthing your skills.
So this is definitely something that varies depending on your situation.
Depending on what country/state you live in, you may or may not have good employment laws protecting you.
On top of that, if you leave on solid terms, your former employer might put in an extra good word for you to your next one. I’ve even had one who offered to write a personal recommendation letter for my next employer.
It depends a lot on how much you are willing/able to play the game, and what the laws are in your region, and the nature of your employment type.
And never forget: The company doesn’t care about you.
This right here. Every time I bring this up, some Lemmy person starts licking the corporate boot.
You’re here to provide a service and get paid. Jumping jobs is the fastest way to increasing your salary. Your first job is to gain experience. The next jobs is supposed to get you paid.
But even after you get a entry level job, I see a lot of jr techs stop learning. Yes, helping someone with their mouse isn’t glamorous. Yes, resetting email passwords isn’t what you took the test for. And no, chances are your job will not let you climb the ladder because you’re doing so well fixing basic end-user BS.
Don’t ever stop learning on your free time and be prepared to jump to hit the higher levels of salary.
Totally right.
The company doesn’t care about you.
I wish more people would understand this.
Also, HR is there to protect the company, not you.
Absolutely accurate.
I’m always a bit irritated by that definite statement that companies don’t care.
The company I work for is small, ~30 people, and my boss/employer as a person cares about me. A lot as a worker/employee, maybe less so but also as a person/individual.
Yes, the company as a theoretical construct does not care for or about me. It’s a construct. But that ignores the people in it, and the variance between companies (even if it’s only a minority where leadership personally cares).
Without even a little bit of sarcasm, I am genuinely happy for you. Hold on to this job for as long as you can, because people like that are incredibly rare.
In my 30+ year career in IT I’ve only managed to work for a place like that once. It was 20 years ago, and I was the sixth employee to be hired, and at our peak we were at about 30 people. The owner was a super nice guy who cared about every single one of his employees. I learned a lot from him and consider him to be a friend and a mentor. We weathered the 2008 financial downturn better than most, but eventually business started to dry up and the company was sold to a large competitor. The boss was relegated to a consultancy role, and eventually got pushed out altogether. I lasted another 3 years at that place, but it was never the same after the buyout. Everyone became just another cog in the machine. Every place I worked at before that or since was your typical corporate position where my manager’s supervisor’s boss doesn’t even know I exist, much less care about me.
I consider the first 6 years in that company a highlight of my career, and keep in touch with that boss and others who worked there. So yes, treasure your time at a good workplace, and don’t take for granted the personal connections you make there.
A foot-in-the-door job is colo datacenter tech. I know a major national company that pays about $20/hr and will take what they can get at that price point. Not interesting, not promote-able, bad schedules. But a resume item. Exposure to enterprise-grade equipment. While there, get the advanced certs you realy want and work on networking with the customers and vendors.
It really depends on where you’re coming from. I’ve known several people who made a rather successful transition from a more business oriented position to business intelligence. It’s like data science’s older and less sexy brother :) General domain knowledge of business processes and finances are always a positive and IT knowledge for a junior can consist of as little as SQL knowledge and experience with a reporting and ETL tool.
You don’t get to do a lot of programming, but there’s always demand for people capable of building a proper data warehouse or able to translate an information request in a properly build report. Internal positions are often an option because companies like to retain people with expert knowledge of the inner workings of their information systems.Source: I used to be a BI specialist for ten years or so :)
Thanks for replying with valuable info!
What’s the first step in this direction you’d recommend now?
Learn SQL and data modelling. The Data Warehouse Toolkit by Ralph Kimball is a good introduction to data warehouses and dimensional modelling. It’s not a universal model for data warehouses, but the core concepts remain the same among different implementations. This should give you a good basic understanding of the basic concepts of data warehousing.
I know Reddit isn’t exactly popular here, but their business intelligence community is quite active. It might be a good place to lurk and gain some insights.
Best of luck! :)
Thank you! Is SQL and data modelling the most in-demand IT-related thing I can learn these days to get employed remotely?
Oof, I wouldn’t know about that. I was purely talking from personal experience. I don’t have a good picture of the job market in total, let alone in whichever country you live. If you want to get into the data-related IT fields (data analist, data engineer, business intelligence specialist, etc.) then SQL and data modeling skills are a must-have. But it’s just a small part of a much bigger discipline.
If possible, find some professional career counseling. Someone with better knowledge of the job market where you live might give you some good advice on which steps to take first.
I’ve been in search of a career counselor online but couldn’t find anything worthwhile. Any advice on who I could talk to?
IT Helpdesk/Support is definitely the most entry level position you can get without a related degree or experience. You can self study with a ton of free resources and learn enough to able to do good on a technical interview.
I came in via the support track, my advice would be to gather generalist skills like writing documents, editing spreadsheets, maintaining databases, etc. Once you get your foot in the door with that, grind hard to master all the systems a company uses, and keep expanding that software portfolio. Also look at automation software like Zapier that can bridge the gap between them (make them talk to each other). Operations is a great stepping stone from support, and there will always be a need for the person keeping it all going.
A few years ago, I’d say web dev. I’d hire a junior web dev fresh out of a boot camp with only 6 months of experience at 60-80k.
Today, my company won’t allow it, and I’m fighting to get new devs. We won’t even take a junior without a bunch of core competencies, things that will take at least a year to pick up. But even if we did, there’s a huge pool of applicants who want in.
The first thing to answer is, where do you want to end up?
If your goal is development you probably want to start learning the basics of programming. You can get some of the academic side of things, for free, from sites like MIT’s Open CourseWare site. Their Introduction to Computer Science and Programming in Python is going to be a solid start in that direction.
For systems administration, it can be good to start with the classic CompTIA Trifecta:
The study process for these should, at least, get you understanding the language of systems. I’d also suggest spending time learning Linux and maybe even consider the Linux+ cert, even if your plan is to be a Windows admin. Learning Linux often means learning a lot about how Operating Systems work in general and you can carry that learning into the Windows world where so much is abstracted away and hidden. It’s also worth spending time learning about Kerberos, DNS (because it’s always DNS) and Active Directory. Even if you work with Linux, you’re very likely to have to interact with Active Directory (AD). Having basic knowledge of AD will be helpful for those touchpoints.
Also, if you plan to work in SysAdmin, expect to spend some time working a help desk. It’s possible to skip this, but businesses don’t like putting untested people in charge of servers. You’re going to fuck up as you learn, this is usually less damaging when done on endpoints than servers. Suck it up butttercup and get the experience.For network admin, I’m not as helpful. As others have suggested, getting an old switch and seeking Cisco certs is likely to be a solid start.
For “Cloud” based engineering, the major vendors all have certification paths. Azure, AWS and GCP all have pages you can research their certs. I’d go with AWS or Azure, as I hear more about them. But, that may just be the bubble I work in.
If you want to go into cybersecurity, go work in either systems or network administration for a few years then come back and look at transitioning. While Cybersecurity is the new hotness, you’ll really benefit from a solid understanding of how the systems and network admin folks work. Sure, I have met some folks who went straight into security and did well. I’ve met far more who had zero clue about basic things like, “why is this sysadmin running psexec against this server?” I’m sure I’m pissing a lot of people off with this paragraph, but cybersecurity is not an entry level IT field.
Mostly, what you need is a natural curiosity and a willingness to try things and break stuff. Succeeding in IT is pretty easy, if you are willing to constantly be learning and trying stuff. The minute you get tired of learning or trying new things, it’s time to move into management.
To add to all the other good advice in this thread. I just wanted to point out that the hardest part is going to be getting that first job. So pay attention to any advice about any positions that are currently actively hiring with little to no experience. An alternative is some networking/nepotism and leverage some connections to get you in your first job.
After getting some reasonable level of experience things get a lot easier. You still need to know what you’re doing and be able to prove it, but you’ll face less of an initial barrier and be more likely to get an interview.
Related, if you see a listing for an “entry level” job that requires 5+ years of experience or whatever, apply for it anyway. Odds are no one with experience is going to want to take the salary they’re offering, so you might get an interview.
Vue.js, it’s the simplest of the popular frontend frameworks
You can learn a hellton about sysadmin and DevOps by running a home lab and aiding that with some courses and maybe one cert or two but I wouldn’t splurge on certs that readily.
Golang, Express.js, Nest, Flask, SQL (a must), maybe Spark if you dare. Any popular and expressive framework/language for full stack/backend, except for Rails and PHP, those are dying technologies despite their still relatively high popularity in some countries.
Maybe Flutter, Swift or React Native if you want to get into mobile dev.
Just go to a job board, then to learnxinyminutes.com, pick something and start with building small, then medium sized, then maybe more complex projects or contributing to FLOSS written using your tech of interest (but please, PLEASE don’'t treat OSS contributions primarily as a way to get a job. Pick something you use instead. Try to figure out how you would implement something, do that and don’t let the impostor syndrome win if it uses a tech you’re familiar with whenever you want to open an issue on a git forge.
