Musk is basically a pimp lol
Man up and complain openly, chickenshit. Go on bite the hand that feeds
It’s only a matter of time.
This means we all need to make the ‘President Musk’ joke A LOT MORE.
But its not a joke.
Musk is president.
Trumps just the bitchy wife.
And Vance got cucked all the way to the polls
King Musk and Donald, the Jester.
I just imagine Trump is sitting on the couch, legs crossed, stuffing bonbons in his mouth like somekind of horrific peggy bundy from hell while watching social media on a big screen and furiously replying to every imagined slight.
Musk Puppet, king of Magastan
Ya know… You now have immunity to get rid of him…
who’s joking?
I mean, he did sell himself to the highest bidder.
Now he is Elmo’s pooch.
With Facebook not fact-checking I really see this as an opportunity to galvanize the President Musk fact on as many posts as possible. Complaining about it only makes first lady Trump sound like a woke fake news puppet.
first lady trump is big mad!
…I’m trying to decide if I’m more against the use of misogyny to craft insults or more for using a medium that is most likely to be perceived as embarrassing to the target audience here.
It’s not meant to insult women. It’s meant to insult Trump.
We know he’s a misogynist and we’re not going to change his mind. Look at it as a personally crafted insult I guess.
But first puppet is pretty good too.
We could call him “First puppet.”
Look at this way, you’re taking back the insults that they use and throwing back against them in a way that’s effective because they are who they are. My interpretation are these insults are not actually meant to be an insult to women, just Trump.
I prefer ‘second servant trump’
Vice President Trump should do something about it then
I think we need to allow the wealthy to have pistol duels like in the past. Also they must be to the death. At least we will be rid of one problem regardless each time…
Now that’s an alternative motive for one to get rich. “Why do you think you would be a good fit for this company.”
“I really want to grow my investment portfolio so I can fall into the wealthy category to achieve my dreams”
In the past, the aggrieved party got to choose pistols or swords. And I’m thinking swords would be much more fun to watch. I’d pay good money to watch those two bozos flailing at each other with cutlasses.
Musk can even bring his own sword.
I give that the following odds:
33%: Musks sword explodes, Trump wins
33%: Musks sword works, Musk wins
33%: Musks sword works amazingly but explodes right (or during) killing Trump, everybody wins.
I would pay thousands to watch someone swordfight taint maid Trump to the death
They’d be winded in 30 seconds
They will just use seconds.
Nope, a second was someone who looked over the other guy. THEY have to do it.
I think it would be really amusing to watch them shit themselves in fear live as they miss by a mile and have to reload in order to get the other. Comedy gold.
Joke? What joke? President Musk is proof that the American Dream is well and alive if a South African who isn’t even legally a US American Citizen can buy himself a country as long as he works hard spending the money earned from his father’s child-slave powered emerald mine… Well there’s hope for the rest of us*
- = Provided we become sociopaths with large resources
as long as he works hard spending the money earned from his father’s child-slave powered emerald mine…
I hate this misconception. Barely any of it is emerald money. His wealth is all based off defrauding his customers, investors and the US government, lying about everything, and doing tons of illegal stuff like pump n dumps.
Yes, but without the Emerald Mines he wouldn’t have enough money to be in a position where he could tell lies on that scale. Stealing is a lot easier when you already have a ton of cash.
No one’s going to listen to a crazed drunken hobo when he tries to sell you a timeshare, but if a guy tripping balls on cocaine wearing a nice suit with a proper haircut promises you the literal god damn moon… Well that’s a different story now isn’t it?
It’s not the lie itself, it’s the image you have while telling the lie.
If you see a man’s face and name on a billboard, then see that same man telling you he can spin hay into gold, you believe him. Because how could he have that fancy billboard if he couldn’t?
Also Pump and dumps aren’t illegal anymore
Without money he would have been deported as an illegal immigrant.
You don’t need to be a millionaire to have a nice suit, proper haircut, and cocaine. And yes, those things combined with a load of confidence and the ability to spin bullshit, will sell almost anything to a lot of people.
but in Musks specific case, it was family money that allowed him to tool around America with no job and getting into boardrooms with C level big bank owners as a teenager. If I had put on a suit and done the same thing I’d be politely asked if I had an appointment and then asked to leave.
You need money to grift money
No you don’t, you can always borrow money, or dupe investors. The WeWork dude had his girlfriend (now wife) pay for their dates because he was so broke. Fast, confident talking is more important than money. If you’ve already got money, you don’t need to work to get more money.
Money opens doors. You can be the best speaker in the world but without money you’re a nobody that they won’t make time for.
I agree with your sentiment but to my knowledge Musk is a naturalized US citizen
He got his visa under false pretenses and stayed after it was no longer valid, people have been deported for less
Oh man, President Musk isn’t going to like this. Good thing Trump is too chickenshit to voice this more publicly.
He can’t voice it publicly or he’ll get fired!!
So… Literally no new content.
I hate both of these guys, but this article is repeating old news from a month ago and speculating on the fact that trump has never left anyone unscathed after working with him.
Firstly, “President Musk” isn’t a joke.
Secondly, half the reason everybody says it is to piss off Vice-President Trump.Secondly, half the reason everybody says it is to piss off
Vice-President TrumpFirst Lady Musk.Fixed it for you. Trump doesn’t even have the prestige or influence of a vice president (and that alone speaks volumes) in this situation.
Edit: no offense meant to women/trans folks.
Hey, just so you’re aware, a lot of women and trans people find this joke pretty misogynistic and transphobic since it implies that it would be more demeaning for Elon to be a woman or queer than it is for him to be his regular cringey self. Something to keep in mind so we don’t friendly-fire on our allies!
Edit for anyone still struggling with this: if 👏 you 👏 misgender 👏 ANYONE 👏 on purpose 👏 then 👏 trans 👏 people 👏 will 👏 not 👏 trust 👏 you 👏
ThePowerofGeek, you’re great and appreciated and I hope you don’t read anything below from the people who want you to have a worse reaction so their feelings don’t get hurt vicariously.
I don’t think you, or the people you’re claiming to represent, understand the joke. First Lady Musk refers to Trump, not Elon. The implication isn’t that it’s demeaning to be a woman or queer, but that the spouse of the President has no real power or authority. This has nothing to do with their gender, and everything to do with the fact that they are the unelected spouse of an elected official.
The only ones who benefit when you misinterpret things in a way that implies unintended and unsubstantiated bigotry, are those who can use it to reinforce their claims of a misguidedly hypersensitive left, and thereby undermine justified recognition of intended and substantiated bigotry.
Then simple question, why not use First Gentleman? Kamala Harris’ husband was Second Gentleman and would have been first if she had won.
You’re speaking with a lot of confidence about the validity of the feelings of a group of people who, I’m guessing, you are not apart of.
why not use First Gentleman?
Generally, jokes aren’t funny when you convolute them with a distracting term that people don’t know.
Kamala Harris’ husband was Second Gentleman and would have been first if she had won
This is probably the second time I’ve read that term in 4 years. Still had to think about what it meant. I am getting the impression you don’t make a lot of jokes or find them as vital as I do. I say that because I wrote several paragraphs about jokes, why they are important, and why I think it’s bad if people stop making them. At no point did you respond to a word of that, and here I see you prioritizing “being PC” over a joke landing at all.
Then simple question, why not use First Gentleman? Kamala Harris’ husband was Second Gentleman and would have been first if she had won.
Going by your logic, that would be offensive to me, as a gay man.
But this kind of hypersensitivity, especially when applied regardless of context or intent, is one of the main drivers of the reactionary sentiment that is allowing the right to win elections all over the world. It’s one of the reasons why the “free speech” argument has worked so well in their favor.
Currently, the only ones benefitting from this “moral high-ground” stance are fragile little baby egos like Musk and Trump who can rest assured knowing their opposition would never stoop as low as them, while they get to freely spew as much intentionally evil shit as they want.
A society where no one is ever offended by anyone is a utopia. It’s as desirable as it is unattainable. I think the best thing we can do at the moment is focus on fighting back, not fighting against each other.
Then simple question, why not use First Gentleman?
Because we’ve never actually had a First Gentleman, so the term isn’t familiar. This is a scenario where strict accuracy muddles the rhetoric beyond recognition, which defeats the purpose.
You’re speaking with a lot of confidence about the validity of the feelings of a group of people
When did I say anything about the validity of anyone’s feelings?
Because nobody knows what those are.
Because those terms will not aggravate trump. The intent is to aggravate trump not denigrate femininity. Focus ffs. This isn’t about insulting trans people or women, it’s about fighting back on someone who is trying to hurt them. We will struggle to maintain allies if we cannot focus on the speakers intent and not a willing misinterpretation of their words.
I mean, I understand all that too, but if you have to give that explanation within hours of using the phrase, isn’t it maybe an indication that this is a very real risk:
Something to keep in mind so we don’t friendly-fire on our allies!
Also:
The only ones who benefit when you misinterpret things in a way that implies unintended and unsubstantiated bigotry, are those who can use it to reinforce their claims of a misguidedly hypersensitive left, and thereby undermine justified recognition of intended and substantiated bigotry.
I hate to say it, but I don’t see much difference between relating the position of the right wing in an attempt to silence someone telling you that your turn of phrase was insensitive and actually holding the right wing position yourself. Do with that info what you will, I’m just calling it like I see it.
I am going to stand by my position that misgendering isn’t cool, thanks
The Batman imagery makes a lot of sense, because it’s a fiction and I couldn’t ever imagine “the good guys” taking moral high grounds and winning wars (in Ukraine, etc) without guns.
(I say this as someone who agrees that the USA has way too many guns - but they’re a tool built for a purpose)
Not using the weapons of the enemy is what landed the enemy a victory.
Oh damn the moral paragon of squint batman, the trust fund billionaire beating up the mentally disabled.
Cool the don’t do it. Are you able to do that while not alienating people who share your views perhaps? That’d be great.
So, I tried with you. I attempted to communicate a valid point, which is that comedy is important in society and we should care about it, but you literally ignored all of it completely and came back with this stupid clapping edit which confirms what I already knew. Your argument is in bad faith and you are a counter-productive self righteous person who doesn’t care that you pushed us even further from this level of hypersensitivity than before this conversation. Because the goal here was to feel superior. Enjoy that.
The intent is to say something that will antagonise Trump. The intent is not to demean women.
Attacking someone who shares your moral platform because you purposefully misinterpret their words to suit a separate agenda is friendly fire.
Transphobia and misogyny are not to be tolerated, do you really think that someone attacking turnip (autocorrect, I’m leaving it) online doesn’t share your views on this?
Stip trying to police speech among your allies. Focus on intent. Stop with the nonsense infighting we are at war rn.
I think you’re right about all this. Just wanted to add that this joke is (a little) funny because it simultaneously points out that trump and Elon are misogynistic and kind of gleefully watches them squirm about it, since you know they are also reading it in their own social media feeds.
If someone is offended by this joke, I would agree it’s kind of hypersensitive but more importantly they are missing what the joke means at all. They noticed concepts they get upset about and not really understood how the concepts are being used.
Tldr; This joke is funny because it points out these assholes’ bigotry and taunts them with it. It kind of trusts the audience to see that the entirety of the joke is inherently mocking someone for being a bigot.
Frankly I think you’ve put it better than I did.
That’s exactly what the joke is about.
The punchline is: ‘they are bigots’, not: ’fuck trans people and women’.
Appreciate you.
Haha I’ll take that encouragement! I appreciate you speaking up too. I have tried this kind of pushback before and it’s too easy to get mobbed with accusations of being an awful person, so I tried to tread lightly to avoid a completely pointless hatefest. I think it also speaks to Lemmy and maybe my blocklist that that didn’t happen here. On reddit I’m 99% sure if people read what we wrote we’d get flooded inboxes saying we’re just trying to justify transphobia/misogyny/etc.
Why are trans people’s feelings less important than feelings of people making jokes online?
I don’t want to be arguing here either, that’s why I’m politely letting folks know that these sort of jokes may alienate their allies. You don’t have to do anything with that information if you don’t want to! Don’t engage with this at all, and feel free to let me know what material good you’ve done to fight for trans rights in the time saved, will you?
They are not just jokes. People posting these things are doing so specifically to antagonise the right.
I’m telling you that your concern trolling is alienating allies.
I have chosen to engage in this just like you chose to deal with the blowback when you posted it.
All I have done to “fight for trans rights” is to speak out when I can, challenge bigotry as I am challenging you right now, stand up and be counted at queer marches/events and raise a daughter who took the only trans kid in her high school to prom.
You don’t know my life and that isn’t the discussion. Stop deflecting and learn to focus on intent.
Stop deflecting and learn to focus on intent.
I’m also in favor of the viewpoint that the “First Lady Trump” joke was fine. Just felt the need to comment on the last point; I’ve had that sentiment before too, but I’ve also seen danger in the idea that “Because my intentions were positive, I shouldn’t be criticized.” That’s been a defense used by bigots, too. eg, Trump throwing paper towels to disaster victims (even though he certainly didn’t have to take time out of his day to throw paper towels, gee, how nice he is!)
I’d like to hope that in the past 30 days I’ve never said anything racist/bigoted - but I’d also acknowledge the possibility that despite my positive intentions, I may have. It’s only important because these days very few people think themselves to be bigots. Think about the type of person most likely to say things like “I’m not racist!”
I’m telling you that your concern trolling is alienating allies.
And they are telling you that your lack of empathy is alienating a different set of allies. Those who you seem to claim to be allied with.
Stop deflecting and learn to focus on intent.
I mean, this is 101 stuff.
I don’t put much stock in post votes, but I don’t think a majority popular comment that the person I was replying to already agreed with is, uh, getting blowback. Honestly you seem to be the most hostile one here. If you’d read any of the lovely conversations I’ve already had with folks here, you’d understand that I haven’t blamed anyone for this joke, I am simply communicating what I have heard in the community, and I don’t have any expectations of changes in behavior as a result of this.
It’s not bigotry to call out jokes on the internet, btw. For someone fighting a war on behalf of us all I’d figure this would be lower priority!
I’m going to stop responding to you since you don’t seem to be engaging with the intention to actually listen to minorities, ciao!
I don’t put much stock in post votes, but I don’t think a majority popular comment that the person I was replying to already agreed with is, uh, getting blowback.
I see at least 3 people pushing back and I see you deflecting in each case. Since you seem keen to ignore those comments but mention the upvotes you got originally, it definitely does seem like those matter more to you than the reasonable points being made counter to yours.
I’d figure this would be lower priority!
This is false framing. You’re wanting people to think that they’re prioritizing some dumb joke over real lives getting impacted. Considering the number of suicides that happen amongst comedians as just one obvious sign that people use humor to cope with how fucked up life can be, I’d say humor should be higher priority than it is in society currently. And we obviously don’t need to hurt people’s feelings for humor to exist (already hearing you typing something about that), but if something so benign is elevated throughout society as inappropriate to say, less jokes happen, and frankly more suicides happen (and yes I also hear you typing about trans people having a higher suicide rate – I am aware).
Just as a personal example, I’ve had pretty bad depression for years now but recently started rewatching Malcolm in the Middle again. It’s felt so good to laugh and makes a big difference in my mental health. Due to its age, the show is littered with jokes you could pick apart entirely and remove every sliver of joy from if you wanted to. But since the show makes it incredibly obvious that there’s a good heart behind all those jokes, I chose joy in this case. Joy isn’t something to belittle as just some stupid joke if the criticism levelled actually can prevent countless other (mostly) harmless jokes.
Stip trying to police speech among your allies. Focus on intent. Stop with the nonsense infighting we are at war rn.
Isn’t that what you’re doing by telling trans people to put up or shut up when ‘allies’ use transphobic/misogynist insults against ‘enemies’
How are we supposed to know that we won’t just become the next acceptable target for misogynistic/transphobic abuse if/when we end up on liberals ‘enemies’ list?
Trump and Elon are buffoons, it’s not hard to mock them without tolerating misogyny to do so.
Well the truth is as the world goes down the shitter you’ll lose allies anyway. People don’t care about these issues when they have to worry about shelter and food.
I don’t think the people being misogynistic to some rich assholes on twitter are worried about shelter or food.
That said I also don’t see how the fact that fair-weather allies will eventually abandon their positions when things get hard is a case against having standards for behavior in the here and now.
It isn’t tolerating misogyny, it’s pointing out misogyny and ridiculing misogynists.
It’s OK if you don’t like how that’s being done, and it’s OK if you can’t understand the nuance but policing my speech unchallenged is not what is going to happen.
I think I got the nuance behind ‘bigoted man I disagree with is actually a woman because women amirite?’.
I’m trans, and like actually hate these people, they deserve ridicule. However, if I’m willing to tolerate bigotry on my behalf towards people that are in some out-group, there’s no guarantee that some day I won’t be among that out-group and subsequently targeted by that type of bigotry. Do you understand the issue I’m raising?
I can’t tolerate people misgendering Caitlen Jenner or Blair white because while they suck, it only contributes to an environment where that type of insult is then considered acceptable.
deleted by creator
I think I got the nuance behind ‘bigoted man I disagree with is actually a woman because women amirite?’.
Nope.
It goes like this: ‘bigoted man is bigoted because this will aggravate his orange tits. If bigoted man was not bigoted it would not be possible to rip on him like this.’
Put another way: ‘I am a bigot, said John.’
If that doesn’t clarify it then I’m out of patience to explain further.
First asshole musk
Nah, they have at least two each…
Not actually sure that’s what this joke implies. Any trans/women are welcome to correct me here though. I don’t necessarily trust that this comment getting upvotes indicates that a majority of women and trans people agree with you.
And yes, I know I’ll get downvotes and people convinced I have the worst motives possible but actually my motivation is just that not every joke that can possibly be taken negatively by someone will be taken that way.
I’m just reporting what I’m hearing, I didn’t poll every trans person out there on this. I can’t share my personal communications, but here are two public trans people discussing this over a month ago, if that helps confirm I’m not pulling this from nowhere:
I believe you that someone will think that way about the joke in the thread here on Lemmy, but imo that requires an assumption that I wish people wouldn’t make. Unfortunately I am unable to follow that screenshot you posted. If it contains a joke I am not seeing it.
You asked women or trans people to say otherwise if they disagreed with you- I’m a woman, my friends are trans people, and there are two more trans people as well. Like I said, I can’t poll everyone, but neither can you. You can choose to do with that information what you like, but there’s literally no way to prove this definitively.
As for the screenshot, the order is middle-top-bottom reading order (which I agree is confusing) or smallest font to biggest font. The middle is an account using “Elonia” as a joke, the top is a trans woman who quotes it calling it out for transmisogyny, and the bottom is a trans man replying in agreement with the trans woman.
fwiw I’m a trans woman and I think that it’s still bigotry even if the target is a shitty person. Come up with a more creative insult, it’s not hard to mock shitty people for being shitty without being misogynistic or transphobic.
Thanks for clearing up the post order. I get it now.
I think this is an overreaction to call this person a piece of shit for the joke. It probably took 5 seconds to think of and type. Which tbh so did that reply, which reads more hatefully to me than the joke.
I didn’t mean to imply that if you cannot prove it definitively, you’re “wrong”. These are all opinions. I expanded more on mine in a novel I just wrote in another reply to you (sorry for that length btw)
I appreciate the civil tone here regardless. I know that in the past I’ve seen a lot of conversations like this devolve quickly and I was kinda nervous that could happen 😬
It’s shit like this that makes me understand the difference between a Leftist, a Liberal, and a Tankie.
A Liberal is pro-LGBT rights when it suits them, but will happily queer-code their enemies because at the end of the day, some people are more equal than others.
A Leftist is a normal sane person who can tell which way the wind is blowing, prays for the revolution to come, and doesn’t care about what goes on in another comrade’s bedroom as long as it’s all consensual, unless they’re specifically invited in which case they may bring pizza and a flashdrive of a pirated copy of something classy and colorful to watch when the festivities are over.
And the Tankie would approve of the “God Hates [Slur]” signs, if only they said “Karl Marx”, “The State”, or really anything remnisicent of the kind of boots this particular group likes the lick, instead of “God”, but until that happens they’re allies… for now.
Two tragic truths, Horseshoe Theory is real, and the Democrats are Diet Republicans.
“God Hates [Slur]” signs, if only they said “Karl Marx”, “The State”, or really anything remnisicent of the kind of boots this particular group likes the lick, instead of “God”, but until that happens they’re allies… for now.
I have a lot of experience (too much tbh) with people that position as communists or revolutionaries, but still have conservative brain worms about gay/trans people. Some will self crit when confronted about it, others take the criticism like a personal attack and double down on bigotry.
That response is where the key difference is between someone that’s principled but uninformed and someone who’s just a ‘patriotic’ socialist leaking brainworms.
The instances routinely smeared as ‘rife with tankies’ have generally been the best about actually consistently enforcing rules against bigotry on Lemmy, and in the case of hexbear have been pretty ahead of the curve when it comes to trans inclusion at least from my experience. I only thought to start including pronoun tags in my display name because I liked seeing how normalized it was in their comms.
I have genuinely met people who claimed that LGBT Rights are “Wrong, because it forces Western values on other cultures and are therefore imperialist.”
“Horseshoe theory” is a straw man attempt to defang the left.
I used to believe that, but then I met tankies.
On the flip side, I feel like his daughter would appreciate it.
I’d want to ask her first, because all the trans people I know personally are icked out by it.
Can I ask what you mean here? You passed your phone around to ask your trans friends if this comment offended them…?
I speak with multiple trans people a day? And we share news and articles? And this joke isn’t original?
this joke isn’t original?
For that to be true, I think you must be breaking down the joke to its rough outline to the point that it’s no longer possible to parse this actual joke. If you’re ignoring the target and context, which maybe you are/aren’t, almost any joke can be criticized in a similar way (it might offend someone who could see a similarity between themselves and the way the target is criticized).
In any case I wasn’t looking to ruffle your feathers. Just seemed like a confusing statement to take a very specific joke, about specific people, worded a specific way and consider it just another woman bashing joke. I don’t think that’s what it was, but the person who posted it got kind of scared when you replied the way you did.
I am all for correcting shitty behavior, but I do take some issue with cases where I feel like a charitable reading of an obvious joke was off the table because someone might be offended by it.
And no I’m not a closet conservative or trying to do anything shitty here, just giving an opinion about comedy and intention. Though I expect hate and downvotes because Internet mobs often work that way.
And your fighting for them. Good for you. Want a sticker. It’s a joke. And this can’t offend anybody is how and why we are where we are with more people moving to the right.
Hmm, good to know. Thanks.
What are you talking about? Trump all but runs the republican party at this point. Let’s not forget he has like a third of the population ready to commit violence at the mere suggestion by him that an election was rigged (regardless of the facts). That’s sure seems like influence to me.
Even though it really looks like if any side was trying to steal the election it was the Republicans
Trump isn’t even vice president. He is “guy who has to sign papers.”
Assistant Vice Secretary Pencil Bitch
Rubber-stamp Don
First “Gentleman” Trump.
