• RandomPancake@lemmy.world
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    11 months ago

    Mark my words:

    Trump will win, and it will be largely because of people who refuse to support Biden due to Palestine.

    I will be truly happy if time proves me wrong.

    • Chainweasel@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      Yeah, I don’t understand hating Biden for something that Netanyahu is doing. And there’s only so much Biden could do other than try to play peacekeeper, which he’s been doing. Pretty much any other actions require congressional support. Biden isn’t a king, he can’t unilaterally declare that we’re ending all support for Israel.
      And yet an insane number of people act like he’s over there killing Palestinians with his bare hands.

        • Shyfer@ttrpg.network
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          11 months ago

          If we helped set up a two state solution then we’d have another ally over there. Hell, if we had a one state solution, we’d have one more ally and one less genocidal apartheid state to leash. And tbh, it’s probably better we’re not over there fucking things up anymore.

      • NoIWontPickaName@kbin.social
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        11 months ago

        I know this sounds crazy, but he could not sell them weapons. He is directly supporting what is happening there by doing so.

        Call back carrier groups, stop selling weapons, and let them deal with their own fucking problems that they caused

          • NoIWontPickaName@kbin.social
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            11 months ago

            I mean how many genocides did he do?

            Fuck that stupid blowhard, but at least his genocides are only potential futures, Biden is locked in already at 1

            • acceptable_pumpkin@lemmy.world
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              11 months ago

              What a simply mornonic take. Trump literally tried to pull out of NATO, and he would kill support for Ukraine. There’s your genocide. Oh, and he wouldn’t handle the Palestine situation any differently, so make that 2.

    • alvvayson@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      You could also argue, if Biden loses it will be because of his uncritical support for Israeli war crimes.

      Nobody is forcing Biden to alienate his base.

      And, although I personally don’t believe Joe is supporting genocide, it’s not very realistic to expect people to vote for someone who (in their mind) is supporting genocide.

      • Semi-Hemi-Demigod@kbin.social
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        11 months ago

        Biden’s base is people who are almost as old as the Israel/Palestine conflict. They are not people who are young enough to care about this.

        • alvvayson@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          Lol. If that’s the level of political analysis Biden is gaming on, then he’s gonna fail just like Hilary.

          The name of the game is knowing your base and getting high voter turnout.

          The Republicans understand this. I hope the Democrats don’t forget it like they did in 2016.

          • ZahzenEclipse@kbin.social
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            11 months ago

            Young people don’t vote and young people aren’t what helped biden win last time. They can continue not to vote and it won’t hurt biden.

            • Shyfer@ttrpg.network
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              11 months ago

              Biden had historical turnout from young people. I think it was more based on Trump hate but still they helped. But you’re right, they’re a notoriously unreliable voting base.

    • Verdant Banana@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      maybe the democrats should nut up and put a real non corpo candidate up to bat

      also people like biden and trump took my vote away so do not get to participate in this “democracy”

      • RGB3x3@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        That’s rich. The onus is not on the people to support the Party over policy, it’s the responsibility of the Party to appeal to the people.

        We shouldn’t be blaming voters for the failings of the party and its politicians.

    • CptEnder@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      We should be criticizing our old, conservative president Biden. He needs to 180 his stance.

      Also not voting for him in Nov is vapid and invalidates any defense of the Palestinian people you have.

      It sucks, but it’s reality.

      • givesomefucks@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        It sucks, but it’s reality.

        Yep.

        We legitimately have zero options besides voting for Biden.

        And I sincerely hope enough voters realize that, because trump will be worse.

        The only thing we can do till 2028 is make a lot of noise about how this shit is unacceptable and Dems need to do better

        Unfortunately the DNC knows that while we say it’s unacceptable, we still have to vote Biden or risk trump.

        Which is why the DNC has spent 30 years drifting further and further right. They have captive voters and are willing to risk Republican rule so Dems can be as rightwing as possible.

        • vikingqueef@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          10 months ago

          We legitimately have zero options besides voting for Biden.

          If they stop funding israel and stop giving them arms, would it not get those votes back? are all of you really thinking biden would risk trump winning by refusing to halt arms and cash to israel and let the UN come to a ceasefire resolution? if its so dire, i think THEY have a responsibility to us and the palestinians. for one, all the money going to israel could go to be put to fixing our infrastructure, not destroying gaza’s. two, aren’t we going to need all these missiles and bombs for when we inevitably go to war with russia?

          The only thing we can do till 2028 is make a lot of noise about how this shit is unacceptable and Dems need to do better

          but just like every other election cycle, they will get their votes, continue on w/ biz as usual and then try to win our hearts again and/or fearmonger us again at the next election. with aipac and other big money donors doxxing and ousting progressives, i don’t foresee a functional left after this election, regardless. however, people are mobilizing over this issue and rightly so, its fucking genocide. there is no acceptable amount of genocide and there is no justifiable reason to continue funding and arming it.

        • ZK686@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          I’ll be voting for Trump. I was in favor of his tough stance on illegal immigration, and I still am. Bring out the pitchforks Lemmy!

            • ZK686@lemmy.world
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              11 months ago

              Isn’t this the Politics community? I mean, are all politics allowed…or, ONLY Left an Democrat politics? Smells very…Redditish to me…

              • Rapture@lemmy.world
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                11 months ago

                There isnt a single positive thing on your profile, even on other boards, why would i assume you are here in good faith?

                • ZK686@lemmy.world
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                  11 months ago

                  I’m here because I like to discuss politics. However, just like Reddit…it seems as if this community only leans one way. Sorry to inform you that politics in America is very broad…it’s not just about Democrats and Liberals.

        • RandomPancake@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          This is honestly the best take on the issue I’ve seen so far.

          I am the first person to say we need to break the two-party stranglehold on politics. We need independent candidates in office yesterday. But this election is the abso-fucking-lutely worst time to make a run at that, because that third party vote WILL be a vote for Trump. And if you firmly believe that third party or independent politicians have a place, elect them to your local city council or school board or state legislature. That is where they will make a real, actionable difference.

          A vote against Biden, no matter who for, is a vote for Trump. No amount of TikTok “well ackshually” will change that reality.

          • vikingqueef@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            10 months ago

            last election biden and harris were on the working families party line which is third party. i’m not sure this time around but do y’all even know how third party works?

          • HACKthePRISONS@kolektiva.social
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            11 months ago

            >A vote against Biden, no matter who for, is a vote for Trump.

            this is election misinformation. a vote for anyone except trump cannot be counted as a vote for trump.

            • RandomPancake@lemmy.world
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              11 months ago

              The election is a tug of war. Trump and his supporters are pulling on the right. Biden and his supporters are pulling on the left.

              When you vote for an independent candidate, you are removing force that could have been used to pull against Trump and redirecting that force towards a candidate who has zero chance of winning. A vote for an independent candidate is a vote for Trump.

              The only valid retort to this is “well I wasn’t going to vote anyway” and anyone who feels that way can shut the fuck up about everything.

              • centof@lemm.ee
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                11 months ago

                A vote for an independent candidate is a vote for Trump.

                No. It is a vote for an independent candidate.

                • RandomPancake@lemmy.world
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                  11 months ago

                  Which will remove yet another barrier to Trump becoming president.

                  I’m all for breaking the two-party stranglehold but do it in a local election where it will make a difference. This year is the absolute worst year to try a failed presidential run.

                • acceptable_pumpkin@lemmy.world
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                  11 months ago

                  There you go again with no concept of how politics works in this country. You are either a shill, or a completely naive person. A vote for a 3rd party candidate is as effective as not voting in the national results. Can you at least see that? When electoral votes are tallied, and NONE go to a 3rd party candidate, those votes are wasted.

                  I wish this country had a different voting system other than first past the goal posts, but it doesn’t so you need to be realistic in your vote.

              • HACKthePRISONS@kolektiva.social
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                11 months ago

                >When you vote for an independent candidate, you are removing force that could have been used to pull against Trump

                Jill Stein and Cornel West are running against trump.

                • RandomPancake@lemmy.world
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                  11 months ago

                  That’s nice. They’ll lose, and the momentum put to that independent candidate is momentum that could have been used against Trump. Voting for either of them is a vote for “I am not interested in what happens in this country, and sincerely hope Trump wins. Because instead of voting against him, instead I choose to throw away my vote by making some kind of ‘statement’ that will never be heard by anyone.”

  • return2ozma@lemmy.worldOP
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    11 months ago

    They repeatedly stopped Biden, who appeared frustrated at times, with chants that included “Genocide Joe” and “How many kids will you kill?” in opposition to his support for Israel in its war against Hamas in Gaza.

    Biden supporters drowned them out the protesters with chants of “four more years” and “let’s go, Joe.”

    He struggled to finish his speech, telling the crowd at one point, “They feel deeply.”